**SPAM: Re: [Culturechat] Go as a Canadian
Robert M. Smith
pagman@sbcglobal.net
Wed, 15 Dec 2004 12:16:37 -0600
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Re: **SPAM: Re: [Culturechat] Go as a CanadianSome great points Bob!
While trying not to ever be the "Ugly American" by my behaviour when =
overseas, I would also never try to hide my nationality.=20
Do I sense a little anti-Bush sentiment in the previous mailing?
Robert =20
----- Original Message -----=20
From: Bob Bestor=20
To: culturechat@untours.com=20
Sent: Wednesday, December 15, 2004 11:30 AM
Subject: Re: **SPAM: Re: [Culturechat] Go as a Canadian
If some feel it necessary to reveal, to people of other countries, =
their opposition to certain administration policies, so be it; but to =
masquerade as a citizen of another country - even a country as fine as =
Canada - is several things, including unnecessary (I'm in Europe now, =
have been for the past 3 weeks, and had zero untoward experiences).
Perhaps, when considering the possible embarrassment of being an =
American in Europe, some list members might consider a few events of the =
past 60-plus years, namely:
D-Day, June 6, 1944.
General Dwight Eisenhower's diversion of American troops, at the end =
of the war from the push toward Berlin, to save Paris from gratuitous =
destruction by the Germans.
The Berlin Airlift.
The Marshall Plan.
The billions of dollars spent to defend Germany and Western Europe =
from Soviet takeover during the Cold War.
The several thousand Hungarian freedom fighters who died in 1956 =
when President Eisenhower, fearing a Russian takeover of Berlin, refused =
to support their revolution with more than lip service.
The death of several hundred Cuban patriots at the Bay of Pigs when =
President John Kennedy, also fearing a Russian takeover of Berlin, =
failed to support their counter-revolution. Without U.S. air support, =
they were sitting ducks, trapped on an open beach.
The involvement of U.S. military forces, in Western Europe's =
backyard, to bring about an end to the conflict in the former =
Yugoslavia.
Considering the forgoing, and with the image fresh in mind of =
10,000-plus graves of American soldiers at Omaha Beach cemetery, I have =
no plans to identify myself as anything but an American when traveling =
outside the USA.
Robert H. Bestor, Jr.
Ashland, Oregon
P.S. To apologize to, of all people, the Chinese for our country's =
policies is pretty incredible. By almost anyone's standard, their human =
rights record is disgusting.
Having just recently returned from three weeks in China and one =
week in Japan, we found that the best thing to do is to tell people that =
we are Americans and to state (perhaps reassure) that half the country =
strongly disagrees with the policies of the US government.
We did not find anyone who thought that Bush and his gang were =
good for the world, good for peace, good for security, or good for the =
environment.
It's much better to tell the world how strongly we are against the =
Bush policies.
Boris Sojka
----- Original Message -----
From: WesTexas@aol.com
To: culturechat@untours.com
Sent: Monday, December 13, 2004 9:45 AM
Subject: **SPAM: Re: [Culturechat] Go as a Canadian
In a message dated 12/10/04 2:49:53 PM, hmmcleod@msn.com writes:
Go as anything but Americans? Never!
Normally, I would agree. But since the U.S. has morphed into an =
occupying imperial power, I am frankly reluctant to admit that I am an =
American.
I caught a brief portion of a Fox News segment this weekend =
regarding Iran. The guest suggested a new "Bush Doctrine," to-wit that =
a nuclear (or perhaps radiological) attack on American interests any =
where in the world is to be regarded as an attack on the U.S. by Iran. =
Notice the steady drumbeat for war regarding Iran? =20
In my opinion, Iran is shaping up to be to World War III, as =
Poland was to World War II. In case you haven't grasped the key concept =
by now, we ain't the good guys this time.=20
It is unlikely that the rest of the world is going to stand by =
and let us continue to systematically seize the Middle Eastern oil =
fields. If want to read something that will cause chills to go down =
your spine, I submit the following item from the AP. =20
BEIJING (AP) - China and Russia will hold their first joint =
military exercise next year, the Chinese government said Monday, as =
President Hu Jintao called for an expansion of the rapidly growing =
alliance between the former Cold War rivals.
---
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<BLOCKQUOTE id=3D0><LABEL id=3DHbSession =
SessionId=3D"4250552598"></LABEL>
<DIV><FONT size=3D2>Some great points Bob!</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT size=3D2>While trying not to ever be the "Ugly American" by =
my=20
behaviour when overseas, I would also never try to hide my =
nationality.=20
</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT size=3D2>Do I sense a little anti-Bush sentiment in =
the previous=20
mailing?</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT size=3D2>Robert </FONT></DIV>
<BLOCKQUOTE dir=3Dltr=20
style=3D"PADDING-RIGHT: 0px; PADDING-LEFT: 5px; MARGIN-LEFT: 5px; =
BORDER-LEFT: #000000 2px solid; MARGIN-RIGHT: 0px">
<DIV style=3D"FONT: 10pt arial">----- Original Message ----- </DIV>
<DIV=20
style=3D"BACKGROUND: #e4e4e4; FONT: 10pt arial; font-color: =
black"><B>From:</B>=20
<A title=3Dbob@gemut.com href=3D"mailto:bob@gemut.com">Bob =
Bestor</A> </DIV>
<DIV style=3D"FONT: 10pt arial"><B>To:</B> <A =
title=3Dculturechat@untours.com=20
href=3D"mailto:culturechat@untours.com">culturechat@untours.com</A> =
</DIV>
<DIV style=3D"FONT: 10pt arial"><B>Sent:</B> Wednesday, December 15, =
2004=20
11:30 AM</DIV>
<DIV style=3D"FONT: 10pt arial"><B>Subject:</B> Re: **SPAM: Re: =
[Culturechat]=20
Go as a Canadian</DIV>
<DIV><BR></DIV>
<DIV>If some feel it necessary to reveal, to people of other =
countries,=20
their opposition to certain administration policies, so be it; but =
to=20
masquerade as a citizen of another country - even a country as fine =
as=20
Canada - is several things, including unnecessary (I'm in Europe =
now, have=20
been for the past 3 weeks, and had zero untoward experiences).</DIV>
<DIV><BR></DIV>
<DIV>Perhaps, when considering the possible embarrassment of being =
an=20
American in Europe, some list members might consider a few events of =
the=20
past 60-plus years, namely:</DIV>
<DIV><BR></DIV>
<DIV>D-Day, June 6, 1944.</DIV>
<DIV><BR></DIV>
<DIV>General Dwight Eisenhower's diversion of American troops, at =
the end of=20
the war from the push toward Berlin, to save Paris from gratuitous=20
destruction by the Germans.</DIV>
<DIV><BR></DIV>
<DIV>The Berlin Airlift.</DIV>
<DIV><BR></DIV>
<DIV>The Marshall Plan.</DIV>
<DIV><BR></DIV>
<DIV>The billions of dollars spent to defend Germany and Western =
Europe from=20
Soviet takeover during the Cold War.</DIV>
<DIV><BR></DIV>
<DIV>The several thousand Hungarian freedom fighters who died in =
1956 when=20
President Eisenhower, fearing a Russian takeover of Berlin, refused =
to=20
support their revolution with more than lip service.</DIV>
<DIV><BR></DIV>
<DIV>The death of several hundred Cuban patriots at the Bay of Pigs =
when=20
President John Kennedy, also fearing a Russian takeover of Berlin, =
failed to=20
support their counter-revolution. Without U.S. air support, they =
were=20
sitting ducks, trapped on an open beach.</DIV>
<DIV><BR></DIV>
<DIV>The involvement of U.S. military forces, in Western Europe's =
backyard,=20
to bring about an end to the conflict in the former =
Yugoslavia.</DIV>
<DIV><BR></DIV>
<DIV>Considering the forgoing, and with the image fresh in mind of=20
10,000-plus graves of American soldiers at Omaha Beach cemetery, I =
have no=20
plans to identify myself as anything but an American when traveling =
outside=20
the USA.</DIV>
<DIV><BR></DIV>
<DIV>Robert H. Bestor, Jr.</DIV>
<DIV>Ashland, Oregon</DIV>
<DIV><BR></DIV>
<DIV>P.S. To apologize to, of all people, the Chinese for our =
country's=20
policies is pretty incredible. By almost anyone's standard, their =
human=20
rights record is disgusting.</DIV>
<DIV><BR></DIV>
<DIV><BR></DIV>
<DIV><BR></DIV>
<DIV><BR></DIV>
<BLOCKQUOTE cite=3D"" type=3D"cite"><FONT face=3DArial =
size=3D-1><B>Having just=20
recently returned from three weeks in China and one week in Japan, =
we=20
found that the best thing to do is to tell people that we are =
Americans=20
and to state (perhaps reassure) that half the country strongly =
disagrees=20
with the policies of the =
US government.</B></FONT></BLOCKQUOTE>
<BLOCKQUOTE cite=3D"" type=3D"cite"> </BLOCKQUOTE>
<BLOCKQUOTE cite=3D"" type=3D"cite"><FONT face=3DArial =
size=3D-1><B>We did not=20
find anyone who thought that Bush and his gang were good for the =
world,=20
good for peace, good for security, or good for the=20
environment.</B></FONT></BLOCKQUOTE>
<BLOCKQUOTE cite=3D"" type=3D"cite"> </BLOCKQUOTE>
<BLOCKQUOTE cite=3D"" type=3D"cite"><FONT face=3DArial =
size=3D-1><B>It's much=20
better to tell the world how strongly we are against the Bush=20
policies.</B></FONT></BLOCKQUOTE>
<BLOCKQUOTE cite=3D"" type=3D"cite"> </BLOCKQUOTE>
<BLOCKQUOTE cite=3D"" type=3D"cite"><FONT face=3DArial =
size=3D-1><B>Boris=20
Sojka</B></FONT></BLOCKQUOTE>
<BLOCKQUOTE cite=3D"" type=3D"cite"> </BLOCKQUOTE>
<BLOCKQUOTE cite=3D"" type=3D"cite"><BR>
<BLOCKQUOTE>----- Original Message -----</BLOCKQUOTE>
<BLOCKQUOTE><B>From:</B> <A=20
=
href=3D"mailto:WesTexas@aol.com">WesTexas@aol.com</A></BLOCKQUOTE>
<BLOCKQUOTE><B>To:</B> <A=20
=
href=3D"mailto:culturechat@untours.com">culturechat@untours.com</A></BLOC=
KQUOTE>
<BLOCKQUOTE><B>Sent:</B> Monday, December 13, 2004 9:45 =
AM</BLOCKQUOTE>
<BLOCKQUOTE><B>Subject:</B> **SPAM: Re: [Culturechat] Go as a=20
Canadian</BLOCKQUOTE>
<BLOCKQUOTE><BR></BLOCKQUOTE>
<BLOCKQUOTE><FONT face=3DGeneva color=3D#000000 size=3D-1>In a =
message dated=20
12/10/04 2:49:53 PM,</FONT> <A =
href=3D"mailto:hmmcleod@msn.com"><FONT=20
face=3DGeneva color=3D#000000 =
size=3D-1>hmmcleod@msn.com</FONT></A><FONT=20
face=3DGeneva color=3D#000000 size=3D-1> writes:</FONT><BR><FONT =
face=3DGeneva=20
color=3D#000000 size=3D-1></FONT>
<BLOCKQUOTE cite=3D"" type=3D"cite"><FONT face=3DGeneva =
color=3D#000000=20
size=3D-1>Go as anything but Americans? =20
Never!</FONT><BR></BLOCKQUOTE></BLOCKQUOTE>
<BLOCKQUOTE><FONT face=3DGeneva color=3D#000000 =
size=3D-1><BR>Normally, I=20
would agree. But since the U.S. has morphed into an =
occupying=20
imperial power, I am frankly reluctant to admit that I am an=20
American.<BR><BR>I caught a brief portion of a Fox News segment =
this=20
weekend regarding Iran. The guest suggested a new "Bush =
Doctrine,"=20
to-wit that a nuclear (or perhaps radiological) attack on =
American=20
interests any where in the world is to be regarded as an attack =
on the=20
U.S. by Iran. Notice the steady drumbeat for war =
regarding=20
Iran? <BR><BR>In my opinion, Iran is shaping up to be =
to=20
World War III, as Poland was to World War II. In case you =
haven't=20
grasped the key concept by now, we ain't the good guys this=20
time. <BR><BR>It is unlikely that the rest of the world is =
going to=20
stand by and let us continue to systematically seize the Middle =
Eastern=20
oil fields. If want to read something that will =
cause chills=20
to go down your spine, I submit the following item from the=20
AP. <BR><BR></FONT><FONT color=3D#000000 =
size=3D-1>BEIJING (AP) -=20
China and Russia will hold their first joint military exercise =
next=20
year, the Chinese government said Monday, as President Hu Jintao =
called=20
for an expansion of the rapidly growing alliance between the =
former Cold=20
War rivals.</FONT><BR><FONT face=3DGeneva color=3D#000000=20
size=3D-1></FONT></BLOCKQUOTE></BLOCKQUOTE>
<BLOCKQUOTE cite=3D"" type=3D"cite"><FONT =
face=3DArial></FONT> </BLOCKQUOTE>
<BLOCKQUOTE cite=3D"" type=3D"cite"><FONT =
face=3DArial></FONT> </BLOCKQUOTE>
<BLOCKQUOTE cite=3D"" type=3D"cite"><FONT face=3DGeneva =
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size=3D-1><BR>---<BR>Outgoing mail is certified Virus=20
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href=3D"http://www.grisoft.com"><FONT face=3DGeneva =
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