From ggm2020@att.net Mon May 8 09:51:24 2006 From: ggm2020@att.net (Glenn Marshall) Date: Mon, 8 May 2006 04:51:24 -0400 Subject: [Culturechat] The Swiss and Immigration Message-ID: <03f701c6727d$f8e259e0$2ea94d0c@3211> This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------=_NextPart_000_03EE_01C6725B.0EB57040 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Our local paper reported on a House Judiciary Committee study that was = issued Friday May 5. Their analysis of six countries found that Switzerland, Egypt, Japan, = Sweden, and Mexico all treated illegal entry and unlawful presence as a = criminal offense. The first five of those will jail employers for three = months to three years for hiring illegals. Of the six only Brazil allows = illegals to work without criminal penalties.=20 Here in the U. S. it is not a criminal offense for an illegal immigrant = to be here, but it is a civil one. Looks like we will be hearing a lot more on this subject before the next = U. S. Presidential election. Glenn Marshall ------=_NextPart_000_03EE_01C6725B.0EB57040 Content-Type: text/html; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
Our local paper reported on a House = Judiciary=20 Committee study that was issued Friday May 5.
Their analysis of six = countries found=20 that Switzerland, Egypt, Japan, Sweden, and Mexico=20 all treated illegal entry and unlawful presence as a criminal = offense.=20 The first five of those will jail employers for three = months to=20 three years for hiring illegals. Of the six only Brazil allows illegals = to work=20 without criminal penalties. 
 Here in the U. S. it is not a = criminal=20 offense for an illegal immigrant to be here, but it is a civil = one.
Looks like we will be hearing a lot = more on this=20 subject before the next U. S. = Presidential election.
 
Glenn Marshall
 
------=_NextPart_000_03EE_01C6725B.0EB57040-- From gigli.saw@dplanet.ch Mon May 8 12:28:19 2006 From: gigli.saw@dplanet.ch (Vance Roy) Date: Mon, 8 May 2006 13:28:19 +0200 Subject: [Culturechat] Re: The Swiss and Immigration In-Reply-To: <03f701c6727d$f8e259e0$2ea94d0c@3211> References: <03f701c6727d$f8e259e0$2ea94d0c@3211> Message-ID: <21cc5868321dfeb1ff7edea9d1478341@dplanet.ch> Glenn is right about his post at least in CH. HOWEVER, if one can show that one is a victim of religious, political, or racial persecution, then one can be granted asylum in CH. If a person just enters over a border without proper ID, passport, etc. then they can be deported. Next time you are in the airport, look carefully, and you may see a person in cuffs being escorted to a gate. On 8. Mai 2006, at 10:51, Glenn Marshall wrote: > Our local paper reported on a House Judiciary Committee study that was > issued Friday May 5. > Their analysis of six countries found that Switzerland, Egypt, Japan, > Sweden, and Mexico all treated illegal entry and unlawful presence as > a criminal offense. >   Vance Roy gigli.saw@dplanet.ch http://homepage.mac.com/fredch Church’s chicken is adding beef to the menu? What about the separation of church and steak? AJC Vent From jclancy@billtrak.com Wed May 10 20:00:25 2006 From: jclancy@billtrak.com (Jerry Clancy) Date: Wed, 10 May 2006 15:00:25 -0400 Subject: [Culturechat] Re: [Idyllchat] DSL In-Reply-To: <7C618E03-0658-4F96-95C4-EDF92A0D5BED@sbcglobal.net> References: <6.2.3.4.2.20060509183006.03195ec8@mail.billtrak.com> <6.2.3.4.2.20060509194519.0314bf80@mail.billtrak.com> <7C618E03-0658-4F96-95C4-EDF92A0D5BED@sbcglobal.net> Message-ID: <6.2.3.4.2.20060510125602.031f4aa0@mail.billtrak.com> Russ, See the interspersed notes below. At 10:24 PM 5/9/2006, Russ Crum wrote: >You may have the credentials to tout much of what you claim (e.g. >chaired the IEEE 802 standards committee). Well, it's actually a bit more than that. Subsequent to that I was a member of two different municipal cable TV committees for several years in Minnesota and chairman of another one here in Jersey. In between those appointments I was a vp of engineering for a division of what is now Time-Warner that was responsible for developing the delivery of home electronic services and full-motion video on demand to the cable systems. >However, I think many of your statements do not hold up to scrutiny. >I have DSL even though I could have Comcast, which has it's own host >of problems since it is the 500 pound gorilla in the area. I >regularly check my speed using the same web sites that the everyone >else can use. e.g. Megapath, Speakeasy. My download speed normally >comes in at 1.8-2.3 Mbps and upload speeds at 420-440 kbps. Those >are a far cry from the 100 Kbps that you claim DSL actually >provides!! Incidentally, I do not have "pro" level of DSL service >available and also pay only about 1/2 as much as Comcast subscribers >do. Admittedly, the cable service is faster, but I really don't feel >deprived at the speeds I have. Incidentally, we have two and >sometimes three computers running on the internet simultaneously at >my home with these speeds. FYI, I am about 13,000 feet from the C.O. I never said DSL can't perform but, to do so, some of the typical variables have to change to get decent performance at longer distances, for example: high-speed trunking between the C.O. and the neighborhood distribution hubs; the addition of repeaters and amplifiers (which introduce noise and therefore packet error rates); new builds (ie, in relatively new developments) or rebuilds (new wire) or conditioned lines; newer modems with more sophisticated and higher performing modulation techniques. In some urban, high-rise and dense suburban situations, where the high number of potential drops can justify the cost of new wire and equipment, the phone company may do this and the result is nice, clean, heavier-duty copper. Do some or all of these things and you can achieve higher transmission rates. However, this is far from typical, particularly for older (20+ years) suburban neighborhoods where the phone companies have been loathe to rebuild, particularly "the last mile". The problem is, given the limitations of twisted pairs, it never made economic sense for the companies to do this ( the same reason you rarely ever see "overbuilds" with a second cable company coming into the same area). So they were stuck trying to compete with cable using, in some cases, a 50-year-old infrastructure. The result was DSL performance in those neighborhoods that was so-so to poor to non-existent. In our case, about 10,000 feet or so from the C.O., the copper was so bad it all had to be replaced several years ago, and this was a 23-year-old neighborhood with underground utilities (cable and phone), and it still can't support DSL. And our Trenton office which did use DSL for several years found it troublesome to install and maintain, with so-so service and expensive (business rates). Of course, with cable now threatening their core business, Verizon is now hell bent for leather building new fiber networks to the consumer. If DSL were enough, they wouldn't be doing this. >In your rant you also failed to mention the technical issue of cable >subscribers sharing a fixed bandwidth in their areas. I have had >several Comcast subscribers mention to me the noticeable slowdown in >their internet service in the evenings when other subscribers on >their local net come on line. That is an issue that DSL people do >not have to deal with. A fair point that can be a problem in a badly-engineered system with too many drops per trunk/link. In fact, it happened here some 5-6 years ago and Comcast split the trunk so that each one now has only half the drops it did before and this has not been an issue since. In a properly designed plant this shouldn't be a significant issue. There is a trend, however, to much more bandwidth-intensive applications like video clips. It also raises some questions regarding the efficacy of phone service over cable. Essentially, you are placing an inherently synchronous service inside a distinctly asynchronous one, and one (CSMA/CD, or "Ethernet") which tends to have disastrous response times under heavy loading (say, 50% of capacity). If the "voice packets" can't get out in time due to local loading, they don't make it in time to get reassembled at the destination, so they get dropped and you start sounding like you're talking from the moon. Yes, it's cheaper but I'm in a wait-and-see mode on this one. By the way, you missed one of the real selling points for DSL: security. The "star" nature of the topology means that no one is sharing your line (or, more accurately, circuit), unlike cable where all the neighborhood packets fly by your modem, allowing "packet sniffer" software to read them. Rarely a problem, but it's one of the reasons you should never put credit card info in emails or unsecured HTTP (browser) connections. Of course, this advantage could well disappear in the newer fiber builds depending upon how they are implemented, particularly in the "last mile" (does everyone get their own personal strand or tap into a common one?). >One of the reasons I chose DSL was the ability to dial in with our >laptop from almost anywhere in the US when we are traveling. I don't >know if that has changed, but at the time I signed up for DSL, that >was not an option for Comcast subscribers. I haven't checked this but, as I recall, I can access my mail now from any browser anywhere. In my case it's moot because, instead, I use a VPN (virtual private network) to "take over" my entire system from any remote browser when I'm away. Bottom line is this: * Yours in not, IMHO, the typical suburban experience * Irrespective of price, DSL trumps voice modems * Cable trumps DSL * T-1 and T-3, partial or otherwise, trumps cable (but is priced prohibitively) I've copied the Idyll CultureChat group so you could reply there because, should anyone wish to continue this thread, I suggest it be done there so we don't further bore or confuse the heck out of everyone else. Jerry From astrongone@comcast.net Wed May 10 22:50:50 2006 From: astrongone@comcast.net (Alan Strong) Date: Wed, 10 May 2006 14:50:50 -0700 Subject: [Culturechat] RE: [Idyllchat] DSL In-Reply-To: <6.2.3.4.2.20060510125602.031f4aa0@mail.billtrak.com> Message-ID: <001801c6747b$ce6a9a10$0400a8c0@DH40CF31> This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------=_NextPart_000_0019_01C67441.220BC210 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Contrary to some of the dialog going on; I have enjoyed improving my understanding of the differences and issues between cable & DSL. I felt comfortable with learning about it here because these are 2 available options that we have to use to be on the list. Thanks for the discussion. Alan Strong astrongone@comcast.net -----Original Message----- From: idyllchat-admin@lists.untours.com [mailto:idyllchat-admin@lists.untours.com] On Behalf Of Jerry Clancy Sent: Wednesday, May 10, 2006 12:00 PM To: Russ Crum; culturechat@lists.untours.com Cc: Brian Cooley; Idyll Chat Subject: Re: [Idyllchat] DSL Russ, See the interspersed notes below. At 10:24 PM 5/9/2006, Russ Crum wrote: >You may have the credentials to tout much of what you claim (e.g. >chaired the IEEE 802 standards committee). Well, it's actually a bit more than that. Subsequent to that I was a member of two different municipal cable TV committees for several years in Minnesota and chairman of another one here in Jersey. In between those appointments I was a vp of engineering for a division of what is now Time-Warner that was responsible for developing the delivery of home electronic services and full-motion video on demand to the cable systems. >However, I think many of your statements do not hold up to scrutiny. >I have DSL even though I could have Comcast, which has it's own host >of problems since it is the 500 pound gorilla in the area. I >regularly check my speed using the same web sites that the everyone >else can use. e.g. Megapath, Speakeasy. My download speed normally >comes in at 1.8-2.3 Mbps and upload speeds at 420-440 kbps. Those >are a far cry from the 100 Kbps that you claim DSL actually >provides!! Incidentally, I do not have "pro" level of DSL service >available and also pay only about 1/2 as much as Comcast subscribers >do. Admittedly, the cable service is faster, but I really don't feel >deprived at the speeds I have. Incidentally, we have two and >sometimes three computers running on the internet simultaneously at >my home with these speeds. FYI, I am about 13,000 feet from the C.O. I never said DSL can't perform but, to do so, some of the typical variables have to change to get decent performance at longer distances, for example: high-speed trunking between the C.O. and the neighborhood distribution hubs; the addition of repeaters and amplifiers (which introduce noise and therefore packet error rates); new builds (ie, in relatively new developments) or rebuilds (new wire) or conditioned lines; newer modems with more sophisticated and higher performing modulation techniques. In some urban, high-rise and dense suburban situations, where the high number of potential drops can justify the cost of new wire and equipment, the phone company may do this and the result is nice, clean, heavier-duty copper. Do some or all of these things and you can achieve higher transmission rates. However, this is far from typical, particularly for older (20+ years) suburban neighborhoods where the phone companies have been loathe to rebuild, particularly "the last mile". The problem is, given the limitations of twisted pairs, it never made economic sense for the companies to do this ( the same reason you rarely ever see "overbuilds" with a second cable company coming into the same area). So they were stuck trying to compete with cable using, in some cases, a 50-year-old infrastructure. The result was DSL performance in those neighborhoods that was so-so to poor to non-existent. In our case, about 10,000 feet or so from the C.O., the copper was so bad it all had to be replaced several years ago, and this was a 23-year-old neighborhood with underground utilities (cable and phone), and it still can't support DSL. And our Trenton office which did use DSL for several years found it troublesome to install and maintain, with so-so service and expensive (business rates). Of course, with cable now threatening their core business, Verizon is now hell bent for leather building new fiber networks to the consumer. If DSL were enough, they wouldn't be doing this. >In your rant you also failed to mention the technical issue of cable >subscribers sharing a fixed bandwidth in their areas. I have had >several Comcast subscribers mention to me the noticeable slowdown in >their internet service in the evenings when other subscribers on >their local net come on line. That is an issue that DSL people do >not have to deal with. A fair point that can be a problem in a badly-engineered system with too many drops per trunk/link. In fact, it happened here some 5-6 years ago and Comcast split the trunk so that each one now has only half the drops it did before and this has not been an issue since. In a properly designed plant this shouldn't be a significant issue. There is a trend, however, to much more bandwidth-intensive applications like video clips. It also raises some questions regarding the efficacy of phone service over cable. Essentially, you are placing an inherently synchronous service inside a distinctly asynchronous one, and one (CSMA/CD, or "Ethernet") which tends to have disastrous response times under heavy loading (say, 50% of capacity). If the "voice packets" can't get out in time due to local loading, they don't make it in time to get reassembled at the destination, so they get dropped and you start sounding like you're talking from the moon. Yes, it's cheaper but I'm in a wait-and-see mode on this one. By the way, you missed one of the real selling points for DSL: security. The "star" nature of the topology means that no one is sharing your line (or, more accurately, circuit), unlike cable where all the neighborhood packets fly by your modem, allowing "packet sniffer" software to read them. Rarely a problem, but it's one of the reasons you should never put credit card info in emails or unsecured HTTP (browser) connections. Of course, this advantage could well disappear in the newer fiber builds depending upon how they are implemented, particularly in the "last mile" (does everyone get their own personal strand or tap into a common one?). >One of the reasons I chose DSL was the ability to dial in with our >laptop from almost anywhere in the US when we are traveling. I don't >know if that has changed, but at the time I signed up for DSL, that >was not an option for Comcast subscribers. I haven't checked this but, as I recall, I can access my mail now from any browser anywhere. In my case it's moot because, instead, I use a VPN (virtual private network) to "take over" my entire system from any remote browser when I'm away. Bottom line is this: * Yours in not, IMHO, the typical suburban experience * Irrespective of price, DSL trumps voice modems * Cable trumps DSL * T-1 and T-3, partial or otherwise, trumps cable (but is priced prohibitively) I've copied the Idyll CultureChat group so you could reply there because, should anyone wish to continue this thread, I suggest it be done there so we don't further bore or confuse the heck out of everyone else. Jerry ------=_NextPart_000_0019_01C67441.220BC210 Content-Type: text/html; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable

Contrary to some of the dialog going on; I have enjoyed improving my = understanding of the differences and issues between cable & DSL.  I felt = comfortable with learning about it here because these are 2 available options that = we have to use to be on the list.  Thanks for the = discussion.

 

Alan Strong

astrongone@comcast.net

 

-----Original Message-----
From: idyllchat-admin@lists.untours.com [mailto:idyllchat-admin@lists.untours.com] On Behalf Of Jerry Clancy
Sent: Wednesday, May 10, 2006 12:00 PM
To: Russ Crum; culturechat@lists.untours.com
Cc: Brian Cooley; Idyll Chat
Subject: Re: [Idyllchat] DSL

 

Russ,

 

See the interspersed notes = below.

 

At 10:24 PM 5/9/2006, Russ Crum = wrote:

>You may have the credentials to tout much = of what you claim (e.g.

>chaired the IEEE 802 standards = committee).

 

Well, it's actually a bit more than that. = Subsequent to that I was a

member of two different municipal cable TV = committees for several

years in Minnesota and chairman of another = one here in Jersey. In

between those appointments I was a vp of = engineering for a division

of what is now Time-Warner that was = responsible for developing the

delivery of home electronic services and = full-motion video on demand

to the cable systems.

 

>However, I think many of your statements = do not hold up to scrutiny.

>I have DSL even though I could have = Comcast, which has it's own host

>of problems since it is the 500 pound = gorilla in the area. I

>regularly check my speed using the same = web sites that the everyone

>else can use. e.g. Megapath, Speakeasy. = My download speed normally

>comes in at 1.8-2.3 Mbps and upload = speeds at 420-440 kbps. Those

>are a far cry from the 100 Kbps that you = claim DSL actually

>provides!! Incidentally, I do not have "pro" level of DSL service

>available and also pay only about 1/2 as = much as Comcast subscribers

>do. Admittedly, the cable service is = faster, but I really don't feel

>deprived at the speeds I have. = Incidentally, we have two and

>sometimes three computers running on the = internet simultaneously at

>my home with these speeds. FYI, I am = about 13,000 feet from the C.O.

 

I never said DSL can't perform but, to do so, = some of the typical

variables have to change to get decent = performance at longer

distances, for example: high-speed trunking = between the C.O. and the

neighborhood distribution hubs; the addition = of repeaters and

amplifiers (which introduce noise and = therefore packet error rates);

new builds (ie, in relatively new = developments) or rebuilds (new

wire) or conditioned lines; newer modems with = more sophisticated and

higher performing modulation techniques. In = some urban, high-rise and

dense suburban situations, where the high = number of potential drops

can justify the cost of new wire and = equipment, the phone company may

do this and the result is nice, clean, = heavier-duty copper. Do some

or all of these things and you can achieve = higher transmission rates.

However, this is far from typical, = particularly for older (20+ years)

suburban neighborhoods where the phone = companies have been loathe to

rebuild, particularly "the last = mile".

 

The problem is, given the limitations of = twisted pairs,  it never

made economic sense for the companies to do = this ( the same reason

you rarely ever see "overbuilds" = with a second cable company coming

into the same area). So they were stuck = trying to compete with cable

using, in some cases, a 50-year-old = infrastructure. The result was

DSL performance in those neighborhoods that = was so-so to poor to

non-existent. In our case, about 10,000 feet = or so from the C.O., the

copper was so bad it all had to be replaced = several years ago, and

this was a 23-year-old neighborhood with = underground utilities (cable

and phone), and it still can't support DSL. = And our Trenton office

which did use DSL for several years found it troublesome to install

and maintain, with so-so service and = expensive (business rates). Of

course, with cable now threatening their core business, Verizon is

now hell bent for leather building new fiber = networks to the

consumer. If DSL were enough, they wouldn't = be doing this.

 

>In your rant you also failed to mention = the technical issue of cable

>subscribers sharing a fixed bandwidth in = their areas. I have had

>several Comcast subscribers mention to me = the noticeable slowdown in

>their internet service in the evenings = when other subscribers on

>their local net come on line. That is an = issue that DSL people do

>not have to deal = with.

 

A fair point that can be a problem in a badly-engineered system with

too many drops per trunk/link. In fact, it = happened here some 5-6

years ago and Comcast split the trunk so that = each one now has only

half the drops it did before and this has not = been an issue since. In

a properly designed plant this shouldn't be a significant issue.

There is a trend, however, to much more bandwidth-intensive

applications like video = clips.

 

It also raises some questions regarding the = efficacy of phone service

over cable. Essentially, you are placing an = inherently synchronous

service inside a distinctly asynchronous one, = and one (CSMA/CD, or

"Ethernet") which tends to have = disastrous response times under heavy

loading (say, 50% of capacity). If the = "voice packets" can't get out

in time due to local loading, they don't make = it in time to get

reassembled at the destination, so they get = dropped and you start

sounding like you're talking from the moon. = Yes, it's cheaper but I'm

in a wait-and-see mode on this = one.

 

By the way, you missed one of the real = selling points for DSL:

security. The "star" nature of the = topology means that no one is

sharing your line (or, more accurately, = circuit), unlike cable where

all the neighborhood packets fly by your = modem, allowing "packet

sniffer" software to read them. Rarely a = problem, but it's one of the

reasons you should never put credit card info = in emails or unsecured

HTTP (browser) connections. Of course, this = advantage could well

disappear in the newer fiber builds depending = upon how they are

implemented, particularly in the "last = mile" (does everyone get their

own personal strand or tap into a common = one?).

 

>One of the reasons I chose DSL was the = ability to dial in with our

>laptop from almost anywhere in the US = when we are traveling. I don't

>know if that has changed, but at the time = I signed up for DSL, that

>was not an option for Comcast = subscribers.

 

I haven't checked this but, as I recall, I = can access my mail now

from any browser anywhere. In my case it's = moot because, instead, I

use a VPN (virtual private network) to = "take over" my entire system

from any remote browser when I'm = away.

 

Bottom line is this:

 

* Yours in not, IMHO, the typical suburban = experience

* Irrespective of price, DSL trumps voice = modems

* Cable trumps DSL

* T-1 and T-3, partial or otherwise, trumps = cable (but is priced prohibitively)

 

I've copied the Idyll CultureChat group so = you could reply there

because, should anyone wish to continue this = thread, I suggest it be

done there so we don't further bore or = confuse the heck out of everyone else.

 

Jerry

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

------=_NextPart_000_0019_01C67441.220BC210-- From gigli.saw@dplanet.ch Thu May 11 07:44:42 2006 From: gigli.saw@dplanet.ch (Vance Roy) Date: Thu, 11 May 2006 08:44:42 +0200 Subject: [Culturechat] Re: New comment on Another Tempest in a Teapot In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: One of the comments sent to my blog is below. I think that this person has great insight into the political circus. > REF: AJC vent in your signature line > > Fred, > > Many of your AJC vent expressions in the signature line brought a > smile to my face. > I did not search out the source of 'AJC vent' until the Teddy Kennedy > line appeared. > > A few entries in the first page from the Google search for 'AJC vent' > lead me to the Atlanta newspaper. > > I think your vent expressions in the signature line is a very good way > to characterize you as a thinking person. Each reader is always free > to agree or debate you. > > There is a common fault with the very political 'right' and 'left' > where the management of our future is controlled by those who hide the > truth because it disagrees with the current 'policy' being advocated. > > Examples might be global warming, world energy supply, or avian flu. > > Good science is more benefitial in improving the outcome than the most > popular 'policy'. > > Truthful discusion is essential in resolving any problem. > > Vance Roy gigli.saw@dplanet.ch http://homepage.mac.com/fredch Why is it so difficult to solve murders in the South? Two reasons: All the DNA is the same, and there are no dental records. AJC Vent From broy@dplanet.ch Sun May 14 08:55:58 2006 From: broy@dplanet.ch (Barbara Roy) Date: Sun, 14 May 2006 09:55:58 +0200 Subject: [Culturechat] Kreuz Hotel in Sachseln reopens Message-ID: <52F8820B-36AC-45BA-B712-C9F6FFF3FA87@dplanet.ch> --Apple-Mail-2--365049319 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; delsp=yes; format=flowed After being closed for nine years, the high quality renovated Kreuz Hotel opened today in Sachseln. All of the town's people were invited for drinks, appetizers and a tour of the property. It is truly a jewel and we can't wait to go back for what is sure to be a great meal. Barbara Roy Sachseln Switzerland May 13, 2006 http://www.kodakgallery.com/I.jsp?c=b39pmej.6z3t4zgf&x=0&y=-ynns98 --Apple-Mail-2--365049319 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Content-Type: text/html; charset=ISO-8859-1
After being closed for nine years, the high quality renovated = Kreuz Hotel opened today in Sachseln. All of the town's people were = invited for drinks, appetizers and a tour of the property. It is truly a = jewel and we can't wait to go back for what is sure to be a great = meal.=A0

Barbara Roy=A0
Sachseln Switzerland=A0
May 13, 2006=A0



http://www.kodakgallery.com/I.jsp?c=3Db39pmej.6z3t4zgf&x=3D0&a= mp;y=3D-ynns98
= --Apple-Mail-2--365049319-- From gigli.saw@dplanet.ch Sun May 14 09:13:34 2006 From: gigli.saw@dplanet.ch (Vance Roy) Date: Sun, 14 May 2006 10:13:34 +0200 Subject: [Culturechat] Worms??? Message-ID: <9813cfe867967756a8b401b1869f86a7@dplanet.ch> Come on guys! Worms in the lunch room??? Vance Roy gigli.saw@dplanet.ch http://homepage.mac.com/fredch If life gives you lemons, make lemonade. But if life gives you limes, make margaritas. AJC Vent From joanherriges@att.net Sun May 14 17:27:42 2006 From: joanherriges@att.net (Joan Herriges) Date: Sun, 14 May 2006 09:27:42 -0700 Subject: [Culturechat] Re: [Idyllchat] Kreuz Hotel in Sachseln reopens References: <52F8820B-36AC-45BA-B712-C9F6FFF3FA87@dplanet.ch> Message-ID: <001f01c67773$54ce04d0$9d9f480c@joan> This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------=_NextPart_000_001C_01C67738.A6925680 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Thanks for sharing the happy Kreuz reopening. Photos were great. = Interesting paintings--some Mexican influence there. Good to see V & B = in good form too! Looks like the median is still not quite finished. Have your Castle trip report in hand, highlighted, and will follow in = some of your footsteps next two weeks. Happy BD! Cheers. Joan. =20 ----- Original Message -----=20 From: Barbara Roy=20 To: Idyllchat new ; Idyll Untours Culture Chat=20 Sent: Sunday, May 14, 2006 12:55 AM Subject: [Idyllchat] Kreuz Hotel in Sachseln reopens After being closed for nine years, the high quality renovated Kreuz = Hotel opened today in Sachseln. All of the town's people were invited = for drinks, appetizers and a tour of the property. It is truly a jewel = and we can't wait to go back for what is sure to be a great meal.=20 Barbara Roy=20 Sachseln Switzerland=20 May 13, 2006=20 = http://www.kodakgallery.com/I.jsp?c=3Db39pmej.6z3t4zgf&x=3D0&y=3D-ynns98 ------=_NextPart_000_001C_01C67738.A6925680 Content-Type: text/html; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
Thanks for sharing the happy Kreuz = reopening. =20 Photos were great.  Interesting paintings--some Mexican = influence=20 there.  Good to see V & B in good form too!  Looks like = the median=20 is still not quite finished.
 
Have your Castle trip report in hand, = highlighted,=20 and will follow in some of your footsteps next two weeks.  Happy = BD! =20 Cheers.  Joan. 
----- Original Message -----
From:=20 Barbara = Roy
To: Idyllchat new ; Idyll Untours Culture = Chat=20
Sent: Sunday, May 14, 2006 = 12:55 AM
Subject: [Idyllchat] Kreuz = Hotel in=20 Sachseln reopens

After being closed for nine years, the high = quality=20 renovated Kreuz Hotel opened today in Sachseln. All of the town's = people were=20 invited for drinks, appetizers and a tour of the property. It is truly = a jewel=20 and we can't wait to go back for what is sure to be a great=20 meal. 

Barbara Roy 
Sachseln Switzerland 
May=20 13, 2006 



http://www.kodakgallery.com/I.jsp?c=3Db39pmej.6z3t4zgf&a= mp;x=3D0&y=3D-ynns98
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