From WesTexas@aol.com Sun Jun 2 21:29:19 2002 From: WesTexas@aol.com (WesTexas@aol.com) Date: Sun, 2 Jun 2002 16:29:19 EDT Subject: [Culturechat] An End to Growth? Message-ID: <59.1c6780a6.2a2bda1f@aol.com> --part1_59.1c6780a6.2a2bda1f_boundary Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Content-Language: en This is a little unusual, but it is a very important topic. The Hubbert=20 Curve predicts that worldwide oil production will peak this decade and then=20 go into a terminal decline from which it will never recover. King Hubbert=20 predicted that--at best--we are going to have to learn to live with virtuall= y=20 a zero growth economy. Increasingly, the U.S. will have to follow the=20 European model concerning energy consumption. =20 The two articles referenced below are very interesting. The first article=20 analyzes the fallacy of the economists' arguments against the Hubbert Curve,= =20 and it analyzes the geopolitical aspects of a permanent decline in world oil= =20 production. The second article is based on a presentation that M. King=20 Hubbert made to a congressional committee in the early Seventies. =20 No matter how energy efficient an incremental new house, an incremental new=20 car or an incremental new factory is, each of these items represents an=20 incremental increase in energy demand. The world economy and our entire=20 capital structure are based on the assumption that the energy supplies will=20 be there to meet new incremental demand. What happens to economic growth=20 when energy demand has to conform to energy supply? =20 King Hubbert=E2=80=99s opinion was that the only long term answer, other tha= n a crash=20 nuclear program, is solar--either directly from solar-electric cells or=20 indirectly from the wind. The problem is that Hubbert=E2=80=99s Curve pre= dicts=20 that the decline in oil production is going to hit sooner and harder than 99= %=20 of the population is expecting. And one key factor that may very well=20 worsen the decline is that a good deal of oil that should have been produced= =20 on the second half of the resource curve--such as in the North Sea and on th= e=20 North Slope--was produced earlier because major oil companies were kicked ou= t=20 of the Middle East. This action artificially raised current peak productive= =20 capacity and decreased current oil prices--at the expense of future=20 production and future prices. =20 Hubbert=E2=80=99s Peak & The Economics of Oil (financialsense.com/series3/part1.htm) M. King Hubbert on the Nature of Growth (technology.org/articles/hub-gro.html) Jeffrey Brown --part1_59.1c6780a6.2a2bda1f_boundary Content-Type: text/html; charset="UTF-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Content-Language: en This is a little unusual, but it is a very important t= opic.  The Hubbert Curve predicts that worldwide oil production will pe= ak this decade and then go into a terminal decline from which it will never=20= recover.   King Hubbert predicted that--at best--we are going to h= ave to learn to live with virtually a zero growth economy.   Incre= asingly, the U.S. will have to follow the European model concerning energy c= onsumption. 

The two articles referenced below are very interesting.  The first arti= cle analyzes the fallacy of the economists' arguments against the Hubbert Cu= rve,  and it analyzes the geopolitical aspects of a permanent decline i= n world oil production.   The second article is based on a present= ation that M. King Hubbert made to a congressional committee in the early Se= venties. 

No matter how energy efficient an incremental new house, an incremental new=20= car or an incremental new factory is, each of these items represents an incr= emental increase in energy demand.   The world economy and our ent= ire capital structure are based on the assumption that the energy supplies w= ill be there to meet new incremental demand.  What happens to economic=20= growth when energy demand has to conform to energy supply? 

King Hubbert=E2=80=99s opinion was that the only long term answer, other tha= n a crash nuclear program, is solar--either directly from solar-electric cel= ls or indirectly from the wind.    The problem is that Hubber= t=E2=80=99s Curve predicts that the decline in oil production is going to hi= t sooner and harder than 99% of the population is expecting.   And= one key factor that may very well worsen the decline is that a good deal of= oil that should have been produced on the second half of the resource curve= --such as in the North Sea and on the North Slope--was produced earlier beca= use major oil companies were kicked out of the Middle East.  This actio= n artificially raised current peak productive capacity and decreased current= oil prices--at the expense of future production and future prices. 

Hubbert=E2=80=99s Peak & The Economics of Oil
(financialsense.com/series3/part1.htm)
M. King Hubbert on the Nature of Growth
(technology.org/articles/hub-gro.html)

Jeffrey Brown
 --part1_59.1c6780a6.2a2bda1f_boundary-- From gigli.saw@dplanet.ch Mon Jun 3 09:28:48 2002 From: gigli.saw@dplanet.ch (Vance Roy) Date: Mon, 3 Jun 2002 10:28:48 +0200 Subject: [Culturechat] Working poor in CH Message-ID: This Sunday's Blick newspaper had an article on the working poor in CH. Some people are always interested in salaries in CH and the standard of living that seems higher than the USA. While this is true, there are other sides not often seen. Even among the educated people holding service jobs, etc., there are those whose incomes are barely able to support them. The most interesting job that I saw was that of a flight attendant on the new airline, Swiss. The flight attendant used as an example earned 3600 CHF net per month when he worked for Swissair. Now, that has dropped to 3360 CHF. Consequently, a lot of these folks are now getting at least some help through social service organizations here. There are about 4000 persons employed as flight attendants for Swiss (seems high to me). The salary ranges from 3500 to 4500 CHF net per month. There is no 13th month salary paid at the end of the year as is often the case. Most of these people work two jobs to make ends meet. For a single person, an income of 2100 CHF net per month is the border of the poverty level. This means that the person is eligible for healthcare insurance and rent subsidies. A single person with one child is in poverty at 2800 CHF per month, and a family with two children reaches this level at 4000 CHF monthly. Other examples given for salaries (these are in GROSS amounts not net of taxes and social security): restaurant worker-3519 CHF clothing manufacture worker-3569 CHF store or grocery clerk-4009 CHF garbage worker-4599 CHF garage worker-4706 CHF travel bureau clerk-4824 CHF lumbar worker-4862 CHF It is estimated that 29% of single women and 18% of couples with more than three children struggle on a month to month basis. So, it is evident that those working poor are not all uneducated. All the above jobs require special education and apprenticeships before becoming qualified. Vance Roy gigli.saw@dplanet.ch From WesTexas@aol.com Mon Jun 3 17:30:41 2002 From: WesTexas@aol.com (WesTexas@aol.com) Date: Mon, 3 Jun 2002 12:30:41 EDT Subject: [Culturechat] Working poor in CH Message-ID: The Wall Street Journal had a fascinating article today (6/3/02) about how the writer had a software problem and posted the problem on the web, in order to let people around the world bid on the solving the problem. The winning bid (for $25) was from a software engineer in a Third World country. The writer's advice was to stay away from any careers where what you are doing can be done online. Jeffrey Brown From gigli.saw@dplanet.ch Tue Jun 4 11:17:04 2002 From: gigli.saw@dplanet.ch (Vance Roy) Date: Tue, 4 Jun 2002 12:17:04 +0200 Subject: [Culturechat] An End to Growth? In-Reply-To: <59.1c6780a6.2a2bda1f@aol.com> Message-ID: <37B0D808-77A4-11D6-8EE9-0003936A3F2E@dplanet.ch> --Apple-Mail-1--218531917 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed On Sunday, June 2, 2002, at 10:29 PM, WesTexas@aol.com wrote: > This is a little unusual, but it is a very important topic.=A0 The=20 > Hubbert Curve predicts that worldwide oil production will peak this=20 > decade and then go into a terminal decline from which it will never=20 > recover.=A0=A0 Every time that I come back to CH after a stay in the USA, I have some=20= of the same feelings. Now, don't get me wrong, there are traffic jams in=20= CH, but you have to go looking for them. In the USA, it is evident that=20= at least the interstate system is full. The solution seems to be to=20 build more roads. This takes time, and no one is going to catch up. Today in CH, gasoline is $3.53 per gallon (took 1.38 CHF per liter and=20= extrapolated to US$). There are still plenty of cars, but a car here is=20= a luxury in that you can make your own schedule. There are few places=20 outside of urban America where a car can't be called anything but a=20 requirement. When gasoline hits $10 a gallon in the USA, long before=20 that I will have junked my car here. What will happen to the broad expanses of expressway, huge parking=20 garages, and large parking lots? What use will be found for them? What=20= will be the substitute for transport while the scramble is on to get=20 some sort of mass transit system in place, and how long will that take? Better yet, what sort of government will there be in the USA? When gas=20= hits $10 a gallon will there be insurrection? You can bet your bippy=20 that there will be no politicians around. > Vance Roy gigli.saw@dplanet.ch --Apple-Mail-1--218531917 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Content-Type: text/enriched; charset=ISO-8859-1 On Sunday, June 2, 2002, at 10:29 PM, WesTexas@aol.com wrote: ArialThis is a little unusual, but it is a very important topic.=A0 The Hubbert Curve predicts that worldwide oil production will peak this decade and then go into a terminal decline from which it will never recover.=A0=A0=20 = Arial= Every time that I come back to CH after a stay in the USA, I have some of the same feelings. Now, don't get me wrong, there are traffic jams in CH, but you have to go looking for them. In the USA, it is evident that at least the interstate system is full. The solution seems to be to build more roads. This takes time, and no one is going to catch up. Today in CH, gasoline is $3.53 per gallon (took 1.38 CHF per liter and extrapolated to US$). There are still plenty of cars, but a car here is a luxury in that you can make your own schedule. There are few places outside of urban America where a car can't be called anything but a requirement. When gasoline hits $10 a gallon in the USA, long before that I will have junked my car here. What will happen to the broad expanses of expressway, huge parking garages, and large parking lots? What use will be found for them? What will be the substitute for transport while the scramble is on to get some sort of mass transit system in place, and how long will that take? Better yet, what sort of government will there be in the USA? When gas hits $10 a gallon will there be insurrection? You can bet your bippy that there will be no politicians around. Vance Roy gigli.saw@dplanet.ch= --Apple-Mail-1--218531917-- From WesTexas@aol.com Wed Jun 5 03:20:32 2002 From: WesTexas@aol.com (WesTexas@aol.com) Date: Tue, 4 Jun 2002 22:20:32 EDT Subject: [Culturechat] An End to Growth? Message-ID: --part1_ab.1cefbf79.2a2ecf70_boundary Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit An excellent book on this subject is Hubbert's Peak, by Kenneth Deffeyes. Following is a link to the introductory chapter: http://pup.princeton.edu/chapters/s7121.html --part1_ab.1cefbf79.2a2ecf70_boundary Content-Type: text/html; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit An excellent book on this subject is Hubbert's Peak, by Kenneth Deffeyes.  Following is a link to the introductory chapter: 

http://pup.princeton.edu/chapters/s7121.html --part1_ab.1cefbf79.2a2ecf70_boundary-- From Kraut907@aol.com Wed Jun 5 03:54:02 2002 From: Kraut907@aol.com (Kraut907@aol.com) Date: Tue, 4 Jun 2002 22:54:02 EDT Subject: [Culturechat] An End to Growth? Message-ID: <49.1e68d89c.2a2ed74a@aol.com> My daughter lived in Little Rock,Ar, for ten years, in a nice house in a nic subdivision, and I visited quite a few times. The first thing I noticed ws that there was no way to get downtown or even to a supermarket without a car.There was absolutely no public transportation anywhere near, except for school buses. Every family owned several cars, and they were a necessity. The lack of transportation is not so crass here in the Washington area; and often a car just saves a lot of time and shelter from the elements if one would have to walk to a bus or train. In the CH and Germany, the countries where I have personal knowledge, every little hamlet is connected to the world by bus or train. People don't mind to walk a bit to catch the public transport (as a nice bonus, they are not as chubby as people here). From gigli.saw@dplanet.ch Wed Jun 5 12:52:54 2002 From: gigli.saw@dplanet.ch (Vance Roy) Date: Wed, 5 Jun 2002 13:52:54 +0200 Subject: [Culturechat] Barbarcue in CH Message-ID: Anyone here from 7-9 June in the Heartland or Oberland should check out the World Barbarcue Gold Cup to be held in Spiez. On Friday and Saturday evenings, there will all sorts of goodies prepared by the top 20 teams from all over the world. These folks are serious too. There are juries to select the best. I went to one of these several years ago in Frauenfeld, and it was fun. Check out Vance Roy gigli.saw@dplanet.ch From scudders@hfent.com Wed Jun 5 13:06:12 2002 From: scudders@hfent.com (Jim & Cherie Scudder) Date: Wed, 5 Jun 2002 08:06:12 -0400 Subject: [Culturechat] Barbarcue in CH Message-ID: <000701c20c89$680053e0$1d0c5040@oemcomputer> Vance, I found this an interesting site but no way to know my Deutsch translations were correct! I sent for some rezepte; hope they will honor an American's request! Cherie Scudder From gigli.saw@dplanet.ch Sat Jun 8 12:18:11 2002 From: gigli.saw@dplanet.ch (Vance Roy) Date: Sat, 8 Jun 2002 13:18:11 +0200 Subject: [Culturechat] If you are an Idyller, do not read this Message-ID: <6AFBFE1A-7AD1-11D6-96AE-0003936A3F2E@dplanet.ch> There is an apartment in Sachseln (Heartland in Switzerland) for last minute rental between now and 14 August. There is a one week rental minimum. Sachseln is about 30 minutes south od Luzern toward Interlaken. The apartment is nice and I would gladly stay in it. It CANNOT be rented to anyone who has traveled ANYWHERE with Idyll. Please read that last line again. The apartment will sleep two. It has a full bath (shower only), two twin beds, lots of storage, no stairs to climb, and a nice kitchen area with a stove and microwave oven. Being in Sachseln, it is on the train line with a nice lake. The renters would have to arrange their own airfare and train passes or car rental. The train passes can be purchased after arrival here in CH. I know the landlords. You could not ask for better. Although the renters won't get the Idyll support services, they will be oriented regarding train schedules, activities, etc. If anyone qualified is interested, email me for the cost. Vance Roy gigli.saw@dplanet.ch From gigli.saw@dplanet.ch Mon Jun 10 13:03:03 2002 From: gigli.saw@dplanet.ch (Vance Roy) Date: Mon, 10 Jun 2002 14:03:03 +0200 Subject: [Culturechat] Garden plots Message-ID: <047C29E5-7C6A-11D6-908D-0003936A3F2E@dplanet.ch> A lot of visitors to CH remark on the small plots of ground frequently seen near the outskirts of a town or city with small huts and beautiful gardens of flowers and vegetables. There is usually a hut that can be quite fancy with a patio, BBQ furnace, a flagpole, chairs, etc. people can be seen sitting out or working in the gardens. The nearest one of these to me is in Sarnen, so you can see that the town doesn't have to be too large to have one. These "Family Gardens" were the idea of a Swiss doctor in the last century. He felt that city people would be healthier if they had places to get some fresh air and exercise. From this idea came the family garden. There are 375 of these plots in CH. Each is about 40 feet square, and they are rented by going to a city official in charge of this. There is frequently a waiting list. It costs about 250 CHF a year to rent one of these plots. There is no electric power, but water and and toilets are available. You can outfit your garden with a hut of course, as well as a patio, grill, stoves, and lamps. You are not allowed to spend a night in these however. What you grow is your own business (unless it is a weed to smoke). The use of certain fertilizers and chemicals is controlled though. The gardens are rarely far from the city, so people can reach them easily. There are local clubs that oversee the activities in these plots, and parties and work days are held. There is even a magazine sent to renters of these places. Some of the garden areas are zoned permanently for just that, while others are used on a temporary (sometimes years) basis before the land is put to other use. All in all, if you are an apartment dweller in a big city, these gardens can be an attractive way to get some exercise and get back to nature. Some of this information came by way of "Swiss News", a periodical in English about life in CH. You may find these in kiosks. Vance Roy gigli.saw@dplanet.ch From hmmcleod@msn.com Mon Jun 10 19:00:19 2002 From: hmmcleod@msn.com (hmmcleod) Date: Mon, 10 Jun 2002 14:00:19 -0400 Subject: [Culturechat] Garden plots References: <047C29E5-7C6A-11D6-908D-0003936A3F2E@dplanet.ch> Message-ID: <005f01c210a8$b065b1c0$65fde243@hk26601> Vance: Enjoyed the info on the garden plots. Would also be interested in all the wood piles we saw while in Switzerland in May. Who cuts it; who does it belong to; why are some of the piles dated, etc? Thanks, Harold > From Kraut907@aol.com Tue Jun 11 02:19:59 2002 From: Kraut907@aol.com (Kraut907@aol.com) Date: Mon, 10 Jun 2002 21:19:59 EDT Subject: [Culturechat] Garden plots Message-ID: Was this doctor's name Schreber? They have the same garden plots in Germany, same concept, and they are called "Schrebergaerten". They were a real life saver for many families during and after the war. At least once during summer there was a big garden party for all owners in the neighborhood. From soul25@worldnet.att.net Tue Jun 11 05:28:32 2002 From: soul25@worldnet.att.net (Anita Killen) Date: Mon, 10 Jun 2002 23:28:32 -0500 Subject: [Culturechat] Garden plots References: <047C29E5-7C6A-11D6-908D-0003936A3F2E@dplanet.ch> Message-ID: <3D057C51.302C9C2B@worldnet.att.net> These are very popular in parts of Germany, too. A cousin of mine has one in Freiburg (Breisgau) and grows fabulours flowers on it. Anita Killen Vance Roy wrote: > A lot of visitors to CH remark on the small plots of ground frequently > seen near the outskirts of a town or city with small huts and beautiful > gardens of flowers and vegetables. There is usually a hut that can be > quite fancy with a patio, BBQ furnace, a flagpole, chairs, etc. people > can be seen sitting out or working in the gardens. The nearest one of > these to me is in Sarnen, so you can see that the town doesn't have to > be too large to have one. > > These "Family Gardens" were the idea of a Swiss doctor in the last > century. He felt that city people would be healthier if they had places > to get some fresh air and exercise. From this idea came the family > garden. There are 375 of these plots in CH. Each is about 40 feet > square, and they are rented by going to a city official in charge of > this. There is frequently a waiting list. It costs about 250 CHF a year > to rent one of these plots. There is no electric power, but water and > and toilets are available. You can outfit your garden with a hut of > course, as well as a patio, grill, stoves, and lamps. You are not > allowed to spend a night in these however. What you grow is your own > business (unless it is a weed to smoke). The use of certain fertilizers > and chemicals is controlled though. > > The gardens are rarely far from the city, so people can reach them > easily. There are local clubs that oversee the activities in these > plots, and parties and work days are held. There is even a magazine sent > to renters of these places. Some of the garden areas are zoned > permanently for just that, while others are used on a temporary > (sometimes years) basis before the land is put to other use. > > All in all, if you are an apartment dweller in a big city, these gardens > can be an attractive way to get some exercise and get back to nature. > > Some of this information came by way of "Swiss News", a periodical in > English about life in CH. You may find these in kiosks. > > Vance Roy > gigli.saw@dplanet.ch > > _______________________________________________ > This message was sent by Culturechat. > To reply or send a new message, email to: > Culturechat@untours.com > > Visit the CultureChat archives: > http://mailman.dca.net/pipermail/culturechat/ > > To unsubscribe, change to digest delivery, or > temporarily pause delivery, visit: > http://mailman.dca.net/mailman/listinfo/culturechat From gigli.saw@dplanet.ch Mon Jun 10 19:23:50 2002 From: gigli.saw@dplanet.ch (Vance Roy) Date: Mon, 10 Jun 2002 20:23:50 +0200 Subject: [Culturechat] Garden plots In-Reply-To: <005f01c210a8$b065b1c0$65fde243@hk26601> Message-ID: <3614DDC8-7C9F-11D6-8168-0003936A3F2E@dplanet.ch> --Apple-Mail-1-329073712 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed On Monday, June 10, 2002, at 08:00 PM, hmmcleod wrote: Vance: Enjoyed the info on the garden plots. Would also be interested in all the wood piles we saw while in Switzerland in May. Who cuts it; who does it belong to; why are some of the piles dated, etc? Thanks, Harold Most, if not all, of the wood you likely saw was community wood. Each citizen of a community (has to be born there or married to a citizen) has wood rights. that means of the wood cut by the community (you can't just run out and cut a tree down, it must be approved by a forester), they have the right to a portion of it. I don't think it is to be for sale, but I can't say for sure. The wood is cut and stacked to cure. Then it may be obtained by citizens for their use. In some communities above the tree line, there are peat cutting rights, such as in Andermatt. Vance Roy gigli.saw@dplanet.ch --Apple-Mail-1-329073712 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Type: text/enriched; charset=US-ASCII On Monday, June 10, 2002, at 08:00 PM, hmmcleod wrote: 0000,0000,DEDE Vance: Enjoyed the info on the garden plots. Would also be interested in all the wood piles we saw while in Switzerland in May. Who cuts it; who does it belong to; why are some of the piles dated, etc? Thanks, Harold Most, if not all, of the wood you likely saw was community wood. Each citizen of a community (has to be born there or married to a citizen) has wood rights. that means of the wood cut by the community (you can't just run out and cut a tree down, it must be approved by a forester), they have the right to a portion of it. I don't think it is to be for sale, but I can't say for sure. The wood is cut and stacked to cure. Then it may be obtained by citizens for their use. In some communities above the tree line, there are peat cutting rights, such as in Andermatt. Vance Roy gigli.saw@dplanet.ch --Apple-Mail-1-329073712-- From gigli.saw@dplanet.ch Tue Jun 11 07:24:45 2002 From: gigli.saw@dplanet.ch (Vance Roy) Date: Tue, 11 Jun 2002 08:24:45 +0200 Subject: [Culturechat] Garden plots In-Reply-To: Message-ID: On Tuesday, June 11, 2002, at 03:19 AM, Kraut907@aol.com wrote: > Was this doctor's name Schreber? They have the same garden plots in > Germany, > same concept, and they are called "Schrebergaerten". I don't know this answer, but I'll ask Herr Britschgi when we meet on 20 June. > Vance Roy gigli.saw@dplanet.ch From gigli.saw@dplanet.ch Tue Jun 11 15:37:38 2002 From: gigli.saw@dplanet.ch (Vance Roy) Date: Tue, 11 Jun 2002 16:37:38 +0200 Subject: [Culturechat] The Pope and tap water Message-ID: Two recent studies in CH have shown that over 70% of those surveyed think that the Pope should retire. Similarly, about the same percentage believe that restaurants should furnish their guests with free tap water at the table. Is there a parallel here? Talk about candor: A member of the Federal Council (similar to the USA Cabinet) announced recently that although he did have a small vineyard, he drank more wine than he could produce on his own. Can you see one of Bush's cabinet making such a statement? Vance Roy gigli.saw@dplanet.ch From scudders@hfent.com Wed Jun 12 04:34:40 2002 From: scudders@hfent.com (Jim & Cherie Scudder) Date: Tue, 11 Jun 2002 23:34:40 -0400 Subject: [Culturechat] Garden plots Message-ID: <000701c211c2$19eec040$050c5040@oemcomputer> Roy, what truth is there to what we heard that garden plots were mandated during the war years and after so that the Swiss wouldn't have a problem with food that could draw them out of their neutrality by having to purchase food? Cherie Scudder From gigli.saw@dplanet.ch Wed Jun 12 11:59:47 2002 From: gigli.saw@dplanet.ch (Vance Roy) Date: Wed, 12 Jun 2002 12:59:47 +0200 Subject: [Culturechat] Garden plots In-Reply-To: <000701c211c2$19eec040$050c5040@oemcomputer> Message-ID: <82A0E71D-7DF3-11D6-8AC1-0003936A3F2E@dplanet.ch> The gardens predate WW II. It is true that during WW II, the growing of flowers was forbidden because all available land (even parks) was used for food production. This memory is fresh in the minds of the older generation. I have a friend who told me that he and his family never were starved, but that their mother might say after the meal was served that there was no more food for that day. One wonders if the lack of flowers and the dismal outlook toward a german invasion, doesn't have something to do with the abundance of flowers one now sees. On Wednesday, June 12, 2002, at 05:34 AM, Jim & Cherie Scudder wrote: > Roy, what truth is there to what we heard that garden plots were > mandated > during the war years and after so that the Swiss wouldn't have a problem > with food that could draw them out of their neutrality by having to > purchase > food? Cherie Scudder > > _______________________________________________ Vance Roy gigli.saw@dplanet.ch From gigli.saw@dplanet.ch Wed Jun 12 12:09:56 2002 From: gigli.saw@dplanet.ch (Vance Roy) Date: Wed, 12 Jun 2002 13:09:56 +0200 Subject: [Culturechat] Garden plots In-Reply-To: Message-ID: --Apple-Mail-1-475840251 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed Go to the URL below for a good discussion of Schrebergartens. I thought the guy was Swiss, but I was wrong. http://www.campus-germany.de/english/4.90.336.html On Tuesday, June 11, 2002, at 03:19 AM, Kraut907@aol.com wrote: Was this doctor's name Schreber? They have the same garden plots in Germany, same concept, and they are called "Schrebergaerten". They were a real life saver for many families during and after the war. At least once during summer there was a big garden party for all owners in the neighborhood. Vance Roy gigli.saw@dplanet.ch --Apple-Mail-1-475840251 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Type: text/enriched; charset=US-ASCII Go to the URL below for a good discussion of Schrebergartens. I thought the guy was Swiss, but I was wrong. http://www.campus-germany.de/english/4.90.336.html On Tuesday, June 11, 2002, at 03:19 AM, Kraut907@aol.com wrote: 0000,0000,DEDEWas this doctor's name Schreber? They have the same garden plots in Germany, same concept, and they are called "Schrebergaerten". They were a real life saver for many families during and after the war. At least once during summer there was a big garden party for all owners in the neighborhood. Vance Roy gigli.saw@dplanet.ch --Apple-Mail-1-475840251-- From marilee.taussig@untours.com Tue Jun 11 15:26:30 2002 From: marilee.taussig@untours.com (Marilee Taussig) Date: Tue, 11 Jun 2002 10:26:30 -0400 Subject: [Culturechat] Hostess Gifts -- and cultural cross wires! Message-ID: <4.2.0.58.20020611101903.009a9100@postoffice.dca.net> The recent thread about Hostess Gifts on Idyllchat got me thinking about what a gift means, and how meanings vary so widely between cultures. Since this is Culturechat (whose postings are never as numerous as the fascinating subject of culture deserves), I thought I would add to the conversation by sharing an anecdote about gift-giving and crossed signals. Many years ago, (think late 70's, early 80's) when Idyll was just beginning, another Swiss connection existed in the Taussig family. My brother (Hal Taussig, Jr.) is a Methodist minister, and through our many Swiss acquaintances, an internship program was set up whereby young Swiss people came and worked for a year as volunteer interns at his inner-city Philadelphia church. I was young and single and also attended this church in West Philly. Over the years many of these Swiss interns became (and are still) my dear friends. As it has been mentioned in Idyllchat, the custom of a guest bringing a gift to his host is a strong one in Switzerland. They always bring a gift when they are invited someplace. Back then, upon their arrival in the States, I would regularly invited these young interns over for dinner (I shared a big house in West Philly with other young people/college student types). The Swiss were new, in need of company and I was pretty sure (due to my work with Idyll) that I was the only person in the neighborhood who spoke Swiss German....not that it mattered much; their English was always way better than my German!) One young man brought a gift the first time we invited him...which we appreciated but thought nothing of it. But as he continued to accept invitations, he continued to bring gifts....often flowers. Well, in my experience, flowers brought from a young man to a young lady on a repeated basis often means something a little different than just guest - host politeness. To make a long story short, since I already had a boyfriend at the time, I felt it was prudent to diplomatically discourage these clearly romantic intentions. In my attempts to let this young Swiss man down easy, we ended up having one of those hilarious, tiptoe-through-a-sensitive subject-and-get-your-wires-completely-crossed conversations. It turned out he had no amorous ambitions whatsoever! I wasn't his type! In his culture, plain old good manners tell you not to show up at someone's house who is giving you a free meal, without some token of appreciation in your hand. Flowers were the easiest most convenient token he could come by. You can imagine how awkward it was -- attempting to discourage non-existent romantic aspirations! Now that I know Swiss culture better, I see how both of us were acting perfectly logically. It was just that I was using American code to decipher Swiss gift-giving, and that often leads one wa-a-a-y down the wrong track. Last summer, nearly twenty years later, Peter, the young Swiss man in question brought his wife and two children to visit my family. (my husband and daughter). I told that story again and we all had a good laugh....at our long ago foolishness. We also toasted to the joy of friendships that last...despite our cultural crosswires. Back to the hostess gifts, my experience is that the landlord guest relationship for Untourists can be many things...as it should be. What is of particular joy is that some of these connections end up with 20 years of friendship and good memories attached to them.(whether or not you brought a gift your first time or not!). Marilee Taussig, Idyllchat Administrator ================================================= Untours - Independent Travel With Support! Tel.: 888-UNTOUR-1 Web: Join IdyllChat, an email discussion group on European travel! Visit: "Most Generous Company in America, 1999" awarded by Newman's Own & George magazine. For information on the Idyll Development Foundation, visit: From gigli.saw@dplanet.ch Wed Jun 5 13:14:19 2002 From: gigli.saw@dplanet.ch (Vance Roy) Date: Wed, 5 Jun 2002 14:14:19 +0200 Subject: [Culturechat] An interesting idea Message-ID: For about 25 years, an association of Swiss dentists has worked on a program where the old gold crowns, bridges, etc. removed from patient's mouths, has with their permission, been collected. This amounts to about 50 pounds per year. With this gold, money is obtained to sponsor eye surgery, such as cataract removal in third world countries. About 100,000 patients have had sight saving operations. Now, that is a hoot of an idea! Anyone know if such a thing is done in the USA? Vance Roy gigli.saw@dplanet.ch From ColemanMa@missouri.edu Wed Jun 12 16:17:36 2002 From: ColemanMa@missouri.edu (Coleman, Marilyn J.) Date: Wed, 12 Jun 2002 10:17:36 -0500 Subject: [Culturechat] (no subject) Message-ID: Please unsubscribe From HUB711@aol.com Wed Jun 12 17:41:35 2002 From: HUB711@aol.com (HUB711@aol.com) Date: Wed, 12 Jun 2002 12:41:35 EDT Subject: [Culturechat] Hostess Gifts -- and cultural cross wires! Message-ID: --part1_cd.18c4a44d.2a38d3bf_boundary Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Marilee ... As I read your amusing story, I couldn't help but wish that Jerry Seinfeld still had a weekly sit-com. This material would have been perfect for that show!! Thanks for sharing with all of us Idyll readers. Hadley --part1_cd.18c4a44d.2a38d3bf_boundary Content-Type: text/html; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Marilee ...

As I read your amusing story, I couldn't help but wish that Jerry Seinfeld still had a weekly sit-com. This material would have been perfect for that show!! Thanks for sharing with all of us Idyll readers.

Hadley --part1_cd.18c4a44d.2a38d3bf_boundary-- From Kraut907@aol.com Wed Jun 12 23:06:13 2002 From: Kraut907@aol.com (Kraut907@aol.com) Date: Wed, 12 Jun 2002 18:06:13 EDT Subject: [Culturechat] Hostess Gifts -- and cultural cross wires! Message-ID: <8a.19cd35c9.2a391fd5@aol.com> Marilee, that is a hilarious story, but at the time, I imagine, must have been embarrassing! We have the same custom in Germany, and it's mostly flowers one brings.It used to be quite rigid (I don't know if it still is the same), the number of flowers had to be uneven, and you had to take the paper off before handing the bouquet to the hostess.She, maybe still mashing the potatoes and greeting the guests, has to procure a vase and arrange the flowers in it. Yes, she is mashing the potatoes, because in Germany you don't have a cocktail hour as we have here. Dinner is served very soon, and after-dinner drinks, cognac or liqueur, are popular, because "they help the digestion". Sigrid Washington. From scudders@hfent.com Thu Jun 13 03:00:48 2002 From: scudders@hfent.com (Jim & Cherie Scudder) Date: Wed, 12 Jun 2002 22:00:48 -0400 Subject: [Culturechat] Hostess Gifts -- and cultural cross wires! Message-ID: <001001c2127e$27dd77c0$3b0c5040@oemcomputer> My German friend in the next town who considers me as one of her sisters we are very close) still comes for meals here and brings flowers, or homemade jam or whatever! Yes, flowers are always 3,5, etc--uneven number and never roses!! which are for romance. She went to Germany for 4 weeks this past May, staying with family, friends, friends and relatives of friends and a good chunk of her suitcase had gifts she had made to take along. Our German Kodak friend broght us gifts each visit over 20 years of visits and once he had met our 6 kids, next visits he also included them. On one visit here, he went out of his way in 'Calif where he was touring, to hunt up our eldest son. Our son was amazed; barely remember him, but the German friend was only doing as he had been taught it seems! he still brings me and my husband a gift as does our Swiss friend who visits every few years. You can bet I have a portion of my suitcase set aside for remembrances for all those whom I will visit before and after our untour in July! Cherie Scudder From gigli.saw@dplanet.ch Tue Jun 18 11:26:32 2002 From: gigli.saw@dplanet.ch (Vance Roy) Date: Tue, 18 Jun 2002 12:26:32 +0200 Subject: [Culturechat] Airline security in CH Message-ID: --Apple-Mail-1-991635840 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed I found out some interesting things about Swiss security measures both on the old Swissair and the new Swiss Airlines. First, the new company has installed bulletproof cockpit doors. This was in response to the new USA requirements. Also, Swiss has installed video cameras in the passenger cabin. They did this on their own. Second, sky police ride in the planes now. Also, since the 1970s, there has been a "Tiger" unit in CH. The Tigers are air police made up of rotations of policemen and women from various police departments in CH who ride the planes. This continues but has been in existence since some planes were hijacked by Palestinian sympathizers years ago. Vance Roy gigli.saw@dplanet.ch --Apple-Mail-1-991635840 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Type: text/enriched; charset=US-ASCII 0000,6363,1212I found out some interesting things about Swiss security measures both on the old Swissair and the new Swiss Airlines. First, the new company has installed bulletproof cockpit doors. This was in response to the new USA requirements. Also, Swiss has installed video cameras in the passenger cabin. They did this on their own. Second, sky police ride in the planes now. Also, since the 1970s, there has been a "Tiger" unit in CH. The Tigers are air police made up of rotations of policemen and women from various police departments in CH who ride the planes. This continues but has been in existence since some planes were hijacked by Palestinian sympathizers years ago. Vance Roy gigli.saw@dplanet.ch --Apple-Mail-1-991635840-- From gigli.saw@dplanet.ch Tue Jun 18 16:46:19 2002 From: gigli.saw@dplanet.ch (gigli.saw@dplanet.ch) Date: Tue, 18 Jun 2002 08:46:19 -0700 Subject: [Culturechat] You've been invited to an album at Sony's ImageStation! Message-ID: <200206181546.IAA22819@www0.imagestation.com> --boundary42xyfdfdfd9erer456cv3 Content-type: text/plain You've been invited to an album at Sony's ImageStation! It's called "Down from Frutt to Stoeckalp". Click on the link below to see the ImageStation Album. http://www.imagestation.com/album/?id=4291717399&code=2964969&mode=invite If the above text isn't clickable, just cut and paste it into the address bar of your browser (see the instructions at the bottom of this message). Thanks for using ImageStation! ----------------------------------------------------- Stay in touch. Save time. Protect your memories. Visit http://www.imagestation.com. online photo albums and greeting cards. ----------------------------------------------------- This message was sent to you by Vance Roy. Need Some Help? Please See Below: If your E-mail program does not recognize the above Web address as an active link, you can copy and paste the Web address into your Web browser. Here's how (very easy): 1. Use your mouse to highlight the ENTIRE Web address above 2. Select the EDIT menu and choose COPY 3. Go to your Web browser and CLICK inside the window where you normally type a Web address to visit 4. Select the EDIT menu and choose PASTE 5. Now hit ENTER on your keyboard to take you to the Web address If you would like further assistance please email us at support@imagestation.com --boundary42xyfdfdfd9erer456cv3 Content-type: text/html

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Down from Frutt to Stoeckalp
by fredch


From: Vance Roy (gigli.saw@dplanet.ch)
To: Culture Chat (culturechat@untours.com)
 
You've been invited to an album at Sony's ImageStation! It's called "Down from Frutt to Stoeckalp".
 
 
There are 16 pictures in this album
 
 
Click here to View Album
--boundary42xyfdfdfd9erer456cv3-- From scudders@hfent.com Wed Jun 19 13:45:15 2002 From: scudders@hfent.com (Jim & Cherie Scudder) Date: Wed, 19 Jun 2002 08:45:15 -0400 Subject: [Culturechat] Re: [Idyllchat] Airline security in CH Message-ID: <003501c2178f$2d71f380$420c5040@oemcomputer> This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------=_NextPart_000_0030_01C2176D.A1BA2400 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable This is comforting; thanks for sharing it; too bad the USA record for = making changes hasn't improved this much!=20 Cherie Scudder ------=_NextPart_000_0030_01C2176D.A1BA2400 Content-Type: text/html; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
This is comforting; thanks for = sharing it; too=20 bad the USA record for making changes hasn't improved this much! =
Cherie = Scudder
------=_NextPart_000_0030_01C2176D.A1BA2400-- From Kraut907@aol.com Wed Jun 19 19:02:53 2002 From: Kraut907@aol.com (Kraut907@aol.com) Date: Wed, 19 Jun 2002 14:02:53 EDT Subject: [Culturechat] You've been invited to an album at Sony's ImageStation! Message-ID: <69.28c905e7.2a42214d@aol.com> Thanks for the album! It was a real treat for a rainy afternoon. Also thanks for the security report on Swiss Airlines. I'll be flying with them in October (Berlin and the Ticino, with Untours, natch). Sigrid W. From scudders@hfent.com Thu Jun 20 04:14:12 2002 From: scudders@hfent.com (Jim & Cherie Scudder) Date: Wed, 19 Jun 2002 23:14:12 -0400 Subject: [Culturechat] You've been invited to an album at Sony's ImageStation! Message-ID: <000c01c21808$92420380$270c5040@oemcomputer> Roy, just finished watching your latest group of pics; I had fwd it to the 17 yr old who will accompany us and she is anxious to see it for herself now. Thanks for the time you take to share these with us. Sure appreciate the pics---and you! Cherie Scudder From gigli.saw@dplanet.ch Thu Jun 20 15:55:25 2002 From: gigli.saw@dplanet.ch (Vance Roy) Date: Thu, 20 Jun 2002 16:55:25 +0200 Subject: [Culturechat] A walk down from Melchsee Frutt Message-ID: --Apple-Mail-1--966914377 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed On Monday, June 17, 2002, at 06:56 PM, Vance Roy wrote: It is warm in CH, so I decided to go up to Melchsee Frutt and take a walk down today. It is about two hours and leads one through some beautiful places. Today, especially beautiful because the cows have yet to graze on the wild flowers there. There is still snow above Frutt, so the sounds of the small river follow one down almost all the way. This is one of the quickest hiking areas to reach in our neck of the woods. One goes from Sarnen up to Stoeckalp where a cable car takes you to Frutt. It just opened last Saturday, but there were lots of hikers going up. There is still snow on the mountain sides and some trails are still closed. Frutt is an interesting place. It was once used to quarry marble, and in fact, the marble used in the church in Sachseln, came from Frutt. There was also an iron oar operation there years ago. Today, it is a winter and summer recreation site that is not always full of people. The glacial grooves are an interesting feature. I am told that these formed as a result of the recession of glaciers dragging rocks and stones underneath them. The folding seen in the cliffs is due to that occuring as the alps rose up while still molten. Frutt is a big geological study area and also, a Mecca for those interested in caves. Pictures are on the way. Vance Roy gigli.saw@dplanet.ch --Apple-Mail-1--966914377 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Type: text/enriched; charset=US-ASCII On Monday, June 17, 2002, at 06:56 PM, Vance Roy wrote: 0000,0000,DEDEIt is warm in CH, so I decided to go up to Melchsee Frutt and take a walk down today. It is about two hours and leads one through some beautiful places. Today, especially beautiful because the cows have yet to graze on the wild flowers there. There is still snow above Frutt, so the sounds of the small river follow one down almost all the way. This is one of the quickest hiking areas to reach in our neck of the woods. One goes from Sarnen up to Stoeckalp where a cable car takes you to Frutt. It just opened last Saturday, but there were lots of hikers going up. There is still snow on the mountain sides and some trails are still closed. Frutt is an interesting place. It was once used to quarry marble, and in fact, the marble used in the church in Sachseln, came from Frutt. There was also an iron oar operation there years ago. Today, it is a winter and summer recreation site that is not always full of people. The glacial grooves are an interesting feature. I am told that these formed as a result of the recession of glaciers dragging rocks and stones underneath them. The folding seen in the cliffs is due to that occuring as the alps rose up while still molten. Frutt is a big geological study area and also, a Mecca for those interested in caves. 0000,0000,DEDE Pictures are on the way. Vance Roy gigli.saw@dplanet.ch --Apple-Mail-1--966914377-- From gigli.saw@dplanet.ch Thu Jun 20 15:53:27 2002 From: gigli.saw@dplanet.ch (Vance Roy) Date: Thu, 20 Jun 2002 16:53:27 +0200 Subject: [Culturechat] A step back to the old days Message-ID: <7A43C61E-845D-11D6-B3B5-0003936A3F2E@dplanet.ch> Today was my usual meeting with my Swiss friend, Herr Britschgi. Instead of sitting and talking, this morning we drove to his mother's home in Kerns, near Sarnen. He and his three sisters grew up there, and his father's business was in an attached building there. His deceased father was a wood worker with a specialty in making the various tools and implements used by dairy farmers for the production of cheese. Entering the old shop, one feels as if one has been taken back in history. There are some modern machines, but also, there are implements that are now irreplaceable. Since the early seventies more and more dairy men have gone to the modern tools made out of stainless steel. Still, there are a few orders that trickle in, and Herr Britschgi works on these as time permits. He learned the art from his father but never used it as a means to make a living. He showed me the aged wood (mostly maple) that dries for up to 10 years before being worked. There are lathes, routers, and other electrical finishing tools. There are also tools there used by the old timers, and these are no longer replaceable. There is a furnace used to make steam for bending the staves for the various bowls and the Jaeobs (the rings in which the fresh cheese is sat to cure). The scoops for skimming the cream for butter vary in size from huge to less than a hand width. They are all made of single pieces of wood, some the size of tree trunks. The bowls used to hold the milk for settling have no glued joints. They are made so exact that leaks do not happen. This shop could one day be a nice museum. The things in it are from another age and won't be made again. There are some photos on the way. Vance Roy gigli.saw@dplanet.ch From gigli.saw@dplanet.ch Sat Jun 22 07:24:57 2002 From: gigli.saw@dplanet.ch (gigli.saw@dplanet.ch) Date: Fri, 21 Jun 2002 23:24:57 -0700 Subject: [Culturechat] You've been invited to an album at Sony's ImageStation! Message-ID: <200206220624.XAA16393@www3.imagestation.com> --boundary42xyfdfdfd9erer456cv3 Content-type: text/plain You've been invited to an album at Sony's ImageStation! It's called "A Step into the Past". Click on the link below to see the ImageStation Album. http://www.imagestation.com/album/?id=4291701143&code=2987578&mode=invite If the above text isn't clickable, just cut and paste it into the address bar of your browser (see the instructions at the bottom of this message). Thanks for using ImageStation! ----------------------------------------------------- Stay in touch. Save time. Protect your memories. Visit http://www.imagestation.com. online photo albums and greeting cards. ----------------------------------------------------- This message was sent to you by Vance Roy. Need Some Help? Please See Below: If your E-mail program does not recognize the above Web address as an active link, you can copy and paste the Web address into your Web browser. Here's how (very easy): 1. Use your mouse to highlight the ENTIRE Web address above 2. Select the EDIT menu and choose COPY 3. Go to your Web browser and CLICK inside the window where you normally type a Web address to visit 4. Select the EDIT menu and choose PASTE 5. Now hit ENTER on your keyboard to take you to the Web address If you would like further assistance please email us at support@imagestation.com --boundary42xyfdfdfd9erer456cv3 Content-type: text/html

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A Step into the Past
by fredch



From: Vance Roy (gigli.saw@dplanet.ch)
To: Culture Chat (culturechat@untours.com)
 
You've been invited to an album at Sony's ImageStation! It's called "A Step into the Past".
 
 
There are 7 pictures in this album
 
 
Click here to View Album
--boundary42xyfdfdfd9erer456cv3-- From gigli.saw@dplanet.ch Sun Jun 23 14:53:45 2002 From: gigli.saw@dplanet.ch (Vance Roy) Date: Sun, 23 Jun 2002 15:53:45 +0200 Subject: [Culturechat] Demographics in CH Message-ID: Couples who marry and begin families in CH are in the minority now. Last year, there were almost 10% fewer marriages than the year before. in 2001, there were almost 50% more divorces than the year before. In 2001 the net population by births increased only by 12200. In 1996, this figure was 20400. The number of children born to unwed parents in CH was 11.4% of the total. This contrasts with 22% in Germany and 42% in France. On the other hand, the number of fathers accepting parental responsibilities has increased. Times do change, don't they? Vance Roy gigli.saw@dplanet.ch From jane@mc.net Sun Jun 23 17:53:24 2002 From: jane@mc.net (philip king) Date: Sun, 23 Jun 2002 11:53:24 -0500 Subject: [Culturechat] Demographics in CH References: Message-ID: <002d01c21ad6$7dff44c0$a95f70d1@hppav> Any indication as to what has caused such a drastic reduction in the birthrate in just 6 years, and such a terrific increase in divorces between 2000 and 2001? ----- Original Message ----- From: Vance Roy To: Sent: Sunday, June 23, 2002 8:53 AM Subject: [Culturechat] Demographics in CH > Couples who marry and begin families in CH are in the minority now. Last > year, there were almost 10% fewer marriages than the year before. in > 2001, there were almost 50% more divorces than the year before. > > In 2001 the net population by births increased only by 12200. In 1996, > this figure was 20400. The number of children born to unwed parents in > CH was 11.4% of the total. This contrasts with 22% in Germany and 42% in > France. On the other hand, the number of fathers accepting parental > responsibilities has increased. > > Times do change, don't they? > > Vance Roy > gigli.saw@dplanet.ch > > _______________________________________________ > This message was sent by Culturechat. > To reply or send a new message, email to: > Culturechat@untours.com > > Visit the CultureChat archives: > http://mailman.dca.net/pipermail/culturechat/ > > To unsubscribe, change to digest delivery, or > temporarily pause delivery, visit: > http://mailman.dca.net/mailman/listinfo/culturechat > > From WesTexas@aol.com Sun Jun 23 18:29:47 2002 From: WesTexas@aol.com (WesTexas@aol.com) Date: Sun, 23 Jun 2002 13:29:47 EDT Subject: [Culturechat] Demographics in CH Message-ID: <156.fcc17d7.2a475f8b@aol.com> My best guess for the increase in the divorce rate was the perception of a generally booming world stock market and overall strong economy. If there are more assets in the marriage--and if the partners are confident of finding work--the partners may have felt more confident about setting off on their own. I would suspect that more recent stats will show a significant drop in the divorce rate. In regard to the more recent fall off in the rate of marriage, I suspect that it is reflecting the slumping economy. In regard to the falling birth rate, this is happening across the entire developed world, especially in Europe (most notably in Italy). Jeffrey Brown From gigli.saw@dplanet.ch Mon Jun 24 09:35:14 2002 From: gigli.saw@dplanet.ch (Vance Roy) Date: Mon, 24 Jun 2002 10:35:14 +0200 Subject: [Culturechat] Demographics in CH In-Reply-To: <156.fcc17d7.2a475f8b@aol.com> Message-ID: <4E3FCAC0-874D-11D6-9A70-0003936A3F2E@dplanet.ch> On Sunday, June 23, 2002, at 07:29 PM, WesTexas@aol.com wrote: > My best guess for the increase in the divorce rate was the perception > of a > generally booming world stock market and overall strong economy. A likely cause for the rise is the new law (2 years old) that essentially divides all the assets between the wife and husband. The old rule favored the man greatly. In regard to the more recent fall off in the rate of marriage, I suspect that > it is reflecting the slumping economy. This seems to be a trend in all the western world. This has been seen for over a decade here. > > In regard to the falling birth rate, this is happening across the entire > developed world, especially in Europe (most notably in Italy). > > Jeffrey Brown > > Vance Roy gigli.saw@dplanet.ch From gigli.saw@dplanet.ch Thu Jun 27 13:29:18 2002 From: gigli.saw@dplanet.ch (Vance Roy) Date: Thu, 27 Jun 2002 14:29:18 +0200 Subject: [Culturechat] Is this a surprise? Message-ID: <804B6F53-89C9-11D6-848D-0003936A3F2E@dplanet.ch> In CH, cell phones are known as "Handys". Well, guess what? The market for these little beasts is saturated! Big news, since everyone above the age of 15 has one. In previous years, the average growth rate for Handys was about 6.5%. This year so far it is 1.3%. 75% of the Swiss have a Handy. Even I, who swore he wouldn't, have one. After Barbara fell and broke her ankle just this side of nowhere. I gave in and got one. It cost me one CHF, as long as I use a subscription for 12 months at 25 CHF a month. I still like to sit in the train cars that have the silence logo on the windows, so I don't have to listen to everyone answer and chat. Vance Roy gigli.saw@dplanet.ch From gigli.saw@dplanet.ch Sat Jun 29 18:48:50 2002 From: gigli.saw@dplanet.ch (gigli.saw@dplanet.ch) Date: Sat, 29 Jun 2002 10:48:50 -0700 Subject: [Culturechat] You've been invited to an album at Sony's ImageStation! Message-ID: <200206291748.KAA26290@www1.imagestation.com> --boundary42xyfdfdfd9erer456cv3 Content-type: text/plain You've been invited to an album at Sony's ImageStation! It is called A Walk at Langis. Langis is an alpine moor above Sarnen near Sachseln in the Heartland. Click on the link below to see the ImageStation Album. http://www.imagestation.com/album/?id=4291675963&code=3030762&mode=invite If the above text isn't clickable, just cut and paste it into the address bar of your browser (see the instructions at the bottom of this message). Thanks for using ImageStation! ----------------------------------------------------- Stay in touch. Save time. Protect your memories. Visit http://www.imagestation.com. online photo albums and greeting cards. ----------------------------------------------------- This message was sent to you by Vance Roy. Need Some Help? Please See Below: If your E-mail program does not recognize the above Web address as an active link, you can copy and paste the Web address into your Web browser. Here's how (very easy): 1. Use your mouse to highlight the ENTIRE Web address above 2. Select the EDIT menu and choose COPY 3. Go to your Web browser and CLICK inside the window where you normally type a Web address to visit 4. Select the EDIT menu and choose PASTE 5. Now hit ENTER on your keyboard to take you to the Web address If you would like further assistance please email us at support@imagestation.com --boundary42xyfdfdfd9erer456cv3 Content-type: text/html

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 You have been invited to an album!
Album created on 06/29 at 10:37:29
by fredch



From: Vance Roy (gigli.saw@dplanet.ch)
To: Culture Chat (culturechat@untours.com)
 
You've been invited to an album at Sony's ImageStation! It is called A Walk at Langis. Langis is an alpine moor above Sarnen near Sachseln in the Heartland.
 
 
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--boundary42xyfdfdfd9erer456cv3-- From gigli.saw@dplanet.ch Sat Jun 22 16:06:06 2002 From: gigli.saw@dplanet.ch (Vance Roy) Date: Sat, 22 Jun 2002 17:06:06 +0200 Subject: [Culturechat] A Walk through an Alpine Moor Message-ID: <936C483E-85F1-11D6-B6A2-0003936A3F2E@dplanet.ch> Since we are having early summer in CH, we took a walk in an alpine moor to stay cool. Langis is a place above Lake Sarnen at about 4200 feet above sea level. It is an alpine moor. Many features of a low land swamp, including swamp grass and peat are found here. In the summer, lots of locals come here to hike from all over the area. in the winter, it is a cross country ski Mecca. There is a stream running through the forest here that makes an excellent spot for picnics and just plain keeping cool. Those interested in the flora and fauna of a moor will find plenty to interest them. Nearby, there is a place called Schwendi Kaltbad. In ages past there was a spa type hotel here. It burned long ago, but there is a chapel and a rustic restaurant that serves great plain old food, including grilled trout. In summer time, Langis is reached by twice or more daily buses from Sarnen. Take a book and a picnic, maybe a blanket for sitting, something to put into the brook to cool for a drink, and make a day of it. Pics to follow. Vance Roy gigli.saw@dplanet.ch From gigli.saw@dplanet.ch Tue Jun 18 11:23:33 2002 From: gigli.saw@dplanet.ch (Vance Roy) Date: Tue, 18 Jun 2002 12:23:33 +0200 Subject: [Culturechat] Organ donations in CH Message-ID: <717B5699-82A5-11D6-8D79-0003936A3F2E@dplanet.ch> A survey of Swiss attitudes toward organ donations shows: 43% are ready to donate paired organs at any time 31% are willing to have organs donated after death (I assume that the 43% above would do this also) 19% say no to any organ donation 7% don't know what they want to do I always wonder what the USA numbers are in regard to these surveys. Vance Roy gigli.saw@dplanet.ch